Subject: hist-games: Tablero de jesus Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2000 19:55:22 +0100 From: Thierry Depaulis To: hist-games@pbm.com Maybe I am asking a question that has already been discussed in this list, but I have come across several mentions of a reputedly Spanish dice game called 'Tablero de jesus'. In his 'Tablero de Jesus' webpage "Dagonell the Juggler" wrote: >Tablero is a 15th century Spanish gambling game. Players use their own >money as playing pieces and play until they can no longer afford it. >Friendlier games use thirty wooden markers and distribute them equally >between the two players. >The board is seven rows by seven columns, similar to a chess board, but >with one fewer row and column. The board is completely undifferentiated, >but may be decorated as lavishly as the owner wishes. Two standard dice >are used. >(...) The object of the game is to form rows of coins in the center of the >board in order to remove them. and, on Sun, 13 Jul 1997 14:32:15 exactly Ken Tidwell, answering Daniel U. Thibault, wrote something similar: >This game is played with two dice, a seven by seven checkerboard and a >fifteen coin stake supplied by each player. It was very popular in Spain >and in the Spanish possessions in the Low Countries during the first half >of the XVth century. It was banned by the Pope in 1458, the ban enduring >until the early XXth century! adding that the game was turned into a Scottish drinking game called 'Toblaro'. I am curious to read any authority for these assertions. Neither Sebastian de Covarrubias's Tesoro de la lengua castellana o espaņola (1611) nor the Diccionario medieval espaņol have any mention of 'Tablero de jesus'. I have been unable to find any trace of the Pope's 'bando' of 1458. Moreover neither Arie van der Stoep nor Govert Westerveld -- two Dutch scholars who have published impressive works on the history of draughts and who have investigated the Spanish literature from the late Middle Ages to modern times in search of any trace of all board games -- have encountered this game. Of course, we all know that 'Tablero' means "game board", but is there any serious source for 'Tablero de jesus'? Thierry Depaulis Subject: Re: hist-games: Tablero de jesus Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2000 13:08:05 -0500 From: "Mark Waks, AKA Justin du Coeur" Organization: Intermetrics, Inc. To: Thierry Depaulis CC: hist-games@pbm.com Okay, here we go... The information I have on Tablero is based on photocopies provided by Amanda Kendal of Westmoreland; if I recall correctly, her husband Gerhard introduced the game into the SCA. The principal source is a short article by I.Y. Erzbergen-St.Susse, Ph.D., Queenswood Professor of Medieval Studies at Brunswick University. It appears to be from 1971, and was provided as part of the rules to a Tablero set sold by: Erzbergen-St.Susse Co. 5 Teatown Road Croton-on-Hudson, NY 10520 Since the article is still under copyright, I won't transcribe it whole, but the high points are: -- The game is known to have been played by Cistercian monks at the Abbey of Los Santos de Campo in Granada by 1404. -- Boards have been found in a few Spanish abbeys, as well as Tuscany, Provence and the Low Countries. -- The Abbot of Cleaves in England, in 1449 refers in his journal to "the Jesus boarde". -- The Bishop of Limoges defended the game in 1446. -- The game was banned by Sylvester V in 1458. The rules have what appear to be a rubber stamp saying that this ban is no longer in force; it isn't clear to me whether this implies that the ban was lifted recently, or not. -- Cardinal Martino d'Allesandro says in his memoirs that he introduced the game to the papal court in 1456. -- The board being sold by Erzbergen-St.Susse is based on one found at the Abbey of Saint-Michel-des-Fosses in Provence. It is highly decorated, with a floral motif covering most of the squares and various religious symbols on some of them. There is speculation in the footnotes of the rules about how these symbols might have influenced play. There is a reference to a British Prof. Bryce Ryefield as having opined about one of the odder symbols on the board. Okay, so what does all this indicate? It is *possible* that this could all be some sort of hoax by Mr. Erzbergen-St.Susse, but it seems unlikely to me -- the level of detail in the descriptions is unusually good, and the game *feels* like a Renaissance dicing game to me. If it's a hoax, it's a remarkable one. Of more concern is the complete lack of primary source material, which makes it impossible to judge the quality of the reconstruction. For all I know, this could all be some sort of horrible misreconstruction of a Tafl variant. But lacking that primary information, I currently choose to believe that the reconstruction is appropriate -- there's nothing blatantly odd about it. I'd be more than happy to get more information than this, in any respect -- if someone comes up with good reason to believe that the game *isn't* period, that's obviously important to know, and I would dearly love to get the original sources that this is based upon, so I can evaluate the reconstruction. For now, I'm going to believe that the reconstruction is reasonable... -- Justin Subject: Re: hist-games: Tablero de jesus Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2000 09:54:47 +0100 From: Thierry Depaulis To: "Mark Waks, AKA Justin du Coeur" CC: hist-games@pbm.com On Tue, 01 Feb 2000 Mark Waks, aka "Justin du Coeur" wrote: >The information I have on Tablero is based on photocopies provided by >Amanda Kendal of Westmoreland; if I recall correctly, her husband >Gerhard introduced the game into the SCA. > >The principal source is a short article by I.Y. Erzbergen-St.Susse, >Ph.D., Queenswood Professor of Medieval Studies at Brunswick University. >It appears to be from 1971, and was provided as part of the rules to a >Tablero set sold by: > Erzbergen-St.Susse Co. > 5 Teatown Road > Croton-on-Hudson, NY 10520 > >Since the article is still under copyright, I won't transcribe it whole, >but the high points are: That is certainly good information. Thank you for letting us know. >-- The game is known to have been played by Cistercian monks at the >Abbey of Los Santos de Campo in Granada by 1404. Cistercian monks in Granada?? This is highly improbable since Granada was still a muslim city by 1404 and had long been so! >-- Boards have been found in a few Spanish abbeys, as well as Tuscany, >Provence and the Low Countries. I guess the game had different names in Tuscany, Provence and the Low Countries. Does I.Y. Erzbergen-St.Susse name them? >-- The Abbot of Cleaves in England, in 1449 refers in his journal to >"the Jesus boarde". I'd love to hear more about this 15th-century "journal"! Unfortunately I was unable to locate Cleaves. Can any British reader help? >-- The Bishop of Limoges defended the game in 1446. I will ask the Limoges Archives. >-- The game was banned by Sylvester V in 1458. The rules have what >appear to be a rubber stamp saying that this ban is no longer in force; >it isn't clear to me whether this implies that the ban was lifted >recently, or not. This is the worst part of the story: *no Sylvester V has ever existed*! In 1458 there were two successive Popes: Calixtus III, who died in August, then Pius II who was elected some days after. There were only three Sylvesters as regular Popes and one antipope (Sylvester IV, who reigned from 1105 to 1111). >-- Cardinal Martino d'Allesandro says in his memoirs that he introduced >the game to the papal court in 1456. I will check whether there is a Cardinal Martino d'Allesandro. The spelling is strange -- neither Italian nor Spanish -- but the double l may be a mistyping (for d'Alessandro?). >-- The board being sold by Erzbergen-St.Susse is based on one found at >the Abbey of Saint-Michel-des-Fosses in Provence. It is highly >decorated, with a floral motif covering most of the squares and various >religious symbols on some of them. There is speculation in the footnotes >of the rules about how these symbols might have influenced play. There is no place called Saint-Michel-des-Fosses in France... There is a village called Saint-Michel-en-Provence, and... another one called Saint-Maur-des-Fosse's (acute) *with a well-known abbey* which used to belong to the Kings of France. It is now a suburb of Paris (therefore far from Provence). >There is a reference to a British Prof. Bryce Ryefield >as having opined about one of the odder symbols on the board. British Professors are always welcome for opining about odd symbols... ;-) >Okay, so what does all this indicate? It is *possible* that this could >all be some sort of hoax by Mr. Erzbergen-St.Susse, Well, well. Someone who is able to *invent* a Pope can forge everything. Even if 'Tablero de jesus' looks like a "horrible misreconstruction", as you nicely put it, not of Tafl but of Quaeckbord/Queck, aka Dringuet/Trinquet, le Point de l'Echiquier (in France), Prenten, Brentenspiel (in Germany), a game where people diced *over* a chessboard. In Castilian the game was called ' Jaldeta'. >but it seems unlikely to me -- the level of detail >in the descriptions is unusually good, and the game *feels* like a >Renaissance >dicing game to me. This is not my feeling. But historical research cannot rely on "feeling". >If it's a hoax, it's a remarkable one. Guess what is my (temporary) conclusion... Thierry Depaulis